Should Support be Allowed to Give Opinions

[Fraali 1429]

1 hour ago, ThatNerdyGuy said:

Talk about closed minded.

In my opinion, as long you preface that you aren't a staff member and that your opinion does not hold value, you should be able to give an opinion. That doesn't entail your opinion to being right or wrong, just allows you to potentially give better information than just "I can't do anything".

+1

[CorNfLower 67]

1 hour ago, ThatNerdyGuy said:

Talk about closed minded.

In my opinion, as long you preface that you aren't a staff member and that your opinion does not hold value, you should be able to give an opinion. That doesn't entail your opinion to being right or wrong, just allows you to potentially give better information than just "I can't do anything".

+1

 

[Revise 314]

Used to give my opinion when i was support. They come in the channel looking for help and not something a bot could do, you just tell them that it is your personal opinion and not staff and that it is ultimately up to staff discretion. Half of the support issues i hear are also support members moving someone in and saying "what do you want??" and also half of the support team not knowing simple rules. so i can understand why they are not allowed to give opinions.

[Fraali 1429]

I understand as to why Support members aren't allowed to give opinions. Most of the situations we deal with are more into the grey area of the rules.

But most of these cases aren't clear cut, or easy to explain/give an opinion on when it's just a verbal explanation and it makes the rules we give not as accurate. 99% of the time these will go to admins anyway, however support seems to be an in-between to cut down on player reports and give people an explanation on why they may or may not get banned or comped. As long as we give the explanation that our opinions mean nothing, and everything is up to the admins who deal with the situation, we should be able to assist people easier that way.

At the very least, a few support members who have been around in the community and have been in/witnessed near every situation would be able to give an informed opinion on situations, even better if there were video.

As it stands, we are just a "I can't look at your video, but it sounds like this rule. Submit a player report if you feel like you were wronged" and it doesn't help 90% of people coming into support.

[LULA 2022 - PT 13 490]

10 hours ago, kirby3701 said:

Just give facts, you don't have to give your opinion

You can say that but when staff hand out bans based on reports they're still interpreting the facts and giving out their opinions and while the rules say X when it's all said and done bans that aren't 100% cut and dry do come down to the moderator's discretion.

 

If opinion wasn't a factor there wouldn't be a grey area thread for civ rules and ban appeals would be extremely rare, mods are like judges in the aspect that while they are bound to the rules the ruling itself may vary depending on who you get.

 

Theoretically speaking support team members are highly knowledgeable on the rules and barring some requirements and reputation a good ST member could be thrown into a moderator role and do the job just fine. I don't see an issue with them giving opinions as long as they make sure the involved parties know they're nothing more than opinions.

[Bloodmoon 2222]

Just give your opinion, as long as the support team rats aren't around you're fine.

[Ryan 6834]

10 hours ago, Millennium said:

The reason we cant give our opinions is that we are not staff. Since we are not staff we do not make the final decision of ban/unban/comp/etc. Since we dont have the power to do that if we gave an opinion to a member that asked for our opinion and it was wrong, or staff disagreed then it looks bad for support team and it annoys the player/staff because they begin an argument and they bring up support team. I have heard several times from different staff that people always say in the ban/unban that support says I shouldn't have been banned, or that person should have been banned. 

We don't deal with the reports so therefore we do not give our opinions making it easier for staff and not confusing players.

Plus some people in support team have autism and wont know what is bannable or not.

It would be nice to see but it would never happen

 

9 hours ago, Rossco said:

This is not up for discussion. 

Support Team members are not staff, as @Millennium said. This means that anytime you give someone an opinion on a video, they hold it to be a STAFF MEMBER'S opinion since they were handled by someone in teamspeak. This is when problems arise because if you're wrong in the ruling you make, even if by some technicality, that member would then cite a support member as his reasoning in his ban appeal and that annoys the fuck outta staff.

Do not give your opinions on videos as a Support Team member, you will be punished.

Pretty much this^
I can remember countless times I went into support and had someone tell me this isnt bannable, then got banned and tried to use that in my ban appeal. Personally I dont mind support giving their opinions on situations as long as the person they are helping understands in the end that support teams word doesnt overrule the staffs, but 99% of the time that part flies over peoples head and creates more of a shit show in the end rather then a solution

[Slaughter 74]

1 minute ago, Ryan said:

 

Pretty much this^
I can remember countless times I went into support and had someone tell me this isnt bannable, then got banned and tried to use that in my ban appeal. Personally I dont mind support giving their opinions on situations as long as the person they are helping understands in the end that support teams word doesnt overrule the staffs, but 99% of the time that part flies over peoples head and creates more of a shit show in the end rather then a solution

 

[maxg 1289]

6 hours ago, ThatNerdyGuy said:

Talk about closed minded.

In my opinion, as long you preface that you aren't a staff member and that your opinion does not hold value, you should be able to give an opinion. That doesn't entail your opinion to being right or wrong, just allows you to potentially give better information than just "I can't do anything".

this

[F U L T 52]

3 hours ago, Ryan said:

 

 Personally I dont mind support giving their opinions on situations as long as the person they are helping understands in the end that support teams word doesnt overrule the staffs, but 99% of the time that part flies over peoples head and creates more of a shit show in the end rather then a solution

so what ur saying is  i can disregard  rossco input earlier and give my  opinion within reason and a disclaimer  that what i say doesnt mean what will happen can happen.

[Dank MeeMoo 193]

Once told that it is only your opinion and you are NOT a staff member most people realize that it can be over turned. I feel like the main issue with people taking supports word as law is they believe they are staff. Only Ryan knows all of the rules and grey areas so it would be smart to only give your opinion when you are confident in your answer and know all of the details. Overall supports knowledge level varies so greatly that it isn’t the worst idea to only allow specific people to give opinions.