Official Vigilante Proposal

[Bow 787]

3 minutes ago, Cheshyre said:

*TRIGGERED* "Join the APD if you want an MXC" *TRIGGERED*

The point of playing Vigilante is being a fucking Vigilante, not a cop. If you join the APD you're not a Vigilante you're a cop, I see this argument every time this topic comes up and it's just ridiculous that people can't comprehend the point of "Vigilantes are under powered, maybe we should give them a fair opportunity to win a fight?" the point is to change Vigilante, not become a cop, that argument is just a straight up invalid response.

 

This is copypasta from an earlier thread, but I'm sure you didn't read through it based on what you just said.

 

 

You're not even making sense at this point, you are forced to be a cop if you want a fair fight against a Rebe.l

And you are forced to become a medic if you want to revive people permanently without them having to go to a hospital and become pretty much untouchable.

[Tron 23]

5 minutes ago, 3 Rip said:

The sting is fine. 1 taps in head and its like 3 shots in leg. No point making vigis stronger. They are as strong as they are intended to be. 

Actually, just wearing the camo combat helmet takes 3 shots to down unless you hit them in the face. It's 4 shots to the leg from 30 meters, and hitting legs is not as easy as it sounds, and that figure doesn't even include bonus resistance with fatigues. Don't make up numbers, it makes you look unintelligent.

[MrMarek 25]

2 minutes ago, Bow said:

And you are forced to become a medic if you want to revive people permanently without them having to go to a hospital and become pretty much untouchable.

Okay well that's a completely different topic

 

The goal is to give Vigilantes a fair chance in fighting against Rebels.

[PoptartRex 3294]

43 minutes ago, Tron said:

Something I would like someone to explain to me is why rebel's are allowed to have 7.62 rifles, and vigilantes can't have so much as a 6.5mm CQB gun. If someone were to provide a convincing argument for why rebels get the privilege of overwhelming firepower with no questions asked, and no one else does, I'd be impressed.

Simple explanation. Vigilantes were not made to be a role direct opposite to rebels. It was made as some players with a small amount of money to get a bit more. Once again, this server is based off more of APD vs  Rebel again Rebel vs. Rebel. Vigilantes are fine as is. To add ,  vigilantes are terrible rp in my opinion. Get caught, immediately get sent to jail, regardless of whether or not your charges can be justified.

[Dangus 629]

AGAIN, it still would not be a fair fight, they have a 7.62 and can 1 tap at close quarters maybe two shots, a 6.5 requires at least 3-4 shots in a ga. It still wouldn't be a fair fight people.

I'm taking a break from this damn thread, it's making me so fucking stressed.

[Tron 23]

4 minutes ago, TheCmdrRex said:

Simple explanation. Vigilantes were not made to be a role direct opposite to rebels. It was made as some players with a small amount of money to get a bit more. Once again, this server is based off more of APD vs  Rebel again Rebel vs. Rebel. Vigilantes are fine as is. To add ,  vigilantes are terrible rp in my opinion. Get caught, immediately get sent to jail, regardless of whether or not your charges can be justified.

Sure, vigilantes aren't polar opposites to rebels. They can't be. After all, why would they want to go after their bounties since rebels are most often the ones with the bounties.

If this server really is supposed to be APD vs. Rebel and Rebel vs Rebel then why are there any other roles at all. Why not just center the gametype around those three and nothing else. Basically make it wasteland with slight RP. That argument is bullshit.

And vigi's being terrible RP is an opinion. Just because the RP of vigilante in terms of justifiable crimes doesn't always work out for the victim, that's RP for you. People like RP until all of a sudden it start's working against them and now they aren't having fun cause they're not on top.

[Bow 787]

Let me add, lets just say we do give Vigi's an MX for $150k+... You do realize you are just going to make another thread about a week after right? Because rebels will just kill you and deny you a revive so you just completely lose a like $200k loadout. I'm not trying to piss you off here, but again if you were a cop, that 200k loadout? No problem you respawn with it for free, no NLR so just go straight back to the same situation and deal with it (not to mention the perks of having spike strips and flash bangs).

[Tron 23]

2 minutes ago, Bow said:

Let me add, lets just say we do give Vigi's an MX for $150k+... You do realize you are just going to make another thread about a week after right? Because rebels will just kill you and deny you a revive so you just completely lose a like $200k loadout. I'm not trying to piss you off here, but again if you were a cop, that 200k loadout? No problem you respawn with it for free, no NLR so just go straight back to the same situation and deal with it (not to mention the perks of having spike strips and flash bangs).

If that's what they decide to do, so be it. That's RP for you. At least vigi's would have the ability to fight back. Being a vigi is difficult in itself precisely because of that tactic. Vigi's basically have to pretend to not be a vigi right up until they need to engage. Also, if they do decide to camp the body, then they're just sitting there risking their lives. I don't see very many rebels camping bodies of other rebels with far better guns. Not saying it wouldn't happen, just that vigi's should still at least have the option to carry a better gun and risk being robbed or camped, just like a rebel would.

[Barrack Obama 48]

So rebels have access to .338s Mar-10s and Marksmen rifles with DMS scopes. Cops have all that plus a ghost hawk. But vigis cant get a shitty mx????

[JBruesch 483]

2 hours ago, Tron said:

 

Again, this is implying that Vigis follow rules. I have already explained quite a bit of this to you, yet you carelessly just remade the post...

 

1 hour ago, Barrack Obama said:

Because not everyone wants to kiss the police force ass. Vigilantes work alone and we dont have to follow cop rules, just vigilante rules.

idk, maybe get a gang of Vigis and get out of Kavala? Just a thought...

[Tron 23]

6 minutes ago, JBruesch said:

Again, this is implying that Vigis follow rules. I have already explained quite a bit of this to you, yet you carelessly just remade the post...

And I have also discussed this. Vigilantes almost have to break the rules to make any money. Giving them the tools to stand a better chance at being successful while following the rules will reduce the amount of failed RP among vigilantes, not to mention that tier 2 vigilantes would be making a large financial investment in the role, giving them motivation to follow the rules so they don't lose their stuff.

Also, rebels break the rules too. Where's the outrage against them?

[PoptartRex 3294]

21 minutes ago, Tron said:

And vigi's being terrible RP is an opinion. Just because the RP of vigilante in terms of justifiable crimes doesn't always work out for the victim, that's RP for you. People like RP until all of a sudden it start's working against them and now they aren't having fun cause they're not on top.

So it's good RP if I taze someone, read his charges, and send him to jail all within 2 minutes? 

[3 Rip 1649]

34 minutes ago, Tron said:

Actually, just wearing the camo combat helmet takes 3 shots to down unless you hit them in the face. It's 4 shots to the leg from 30 meters, and hitting legs is not as easy as it sounds, and that figure doesn't even include bonus resistance with fatigues. Don't make up numbers, it makes you look unintelligent.

You can trust me I know what im talking about. And I have been playing life long enough to know vigilantes are good the way they are and If you want to arrest people get better at the game. I can promise you if I became a vigi I would have NO problems catching people

[Tron 23]

1 minute ago, TheCmdrRex said:

So it's good RP if I taze someone, read his charges, and send him to jail all within 2 minutes? 

If a person with a bounty, who by getting a bounty subjected themselves to this risk, happened to be super close to a vigilante shop so that your scenario would be feasible, then yes. It's good RP.

[Virus1 459]

If anything I would suggest a good change to the vigi role would involve instead of the person being put straight in jail they were automatically sent to a holding area (HQ or some other place accessible to APD) and the APD were notified that they were there. At that point the vigi gets some sort of compensation and the person can argue their charges with the APD. Better RP and I think ultimately more satisfying for both. The vigi gets their money, the criminal gets a chance to fight their charges and ultimately maybe an extended period for their friends to come fight to break them out.

[Sociopathic 717]

1 hour ago, Tron said:

So you're equating the difference of 9mm versus 7.62 to 7.62 vs .338. The differences between those two scenarios shouldn't have to be explained. It takes 15+ shots from a sting to down a rebel, 3 shots to down a rebel with the MXC. A cop will go down in two hits with 7.62 just like a rebel would go down with 2 hits from .338. The difference in calibers is only extreme with lower caliber guns, AKA .45 and below

I'm say to you what I say to other vigilantes and deputies. Spray the fucking legs.

A few rounds from a 9mm will taze someone in the legs, and with the high rate of fire that the sting has, if you are dumb enough to try and shoot through their vest, you deserve the death you will get after you empty your clip to no avail.

[Merpfer 200]

25 minutes ago, Barrack Obama said:

So rebels have access to .338s Mar-10s and Marksmen rifles with DMS scopes. Cops have all that plus a ghost hawk. But vigis cant get a shitty mx????

Not all rebels at all. And only high ranking officers have Ghost hawks. Rebels cannot get those things unless they do a blackwater. Which has only been done like 10 times maybe?

[Sociopathic 717]

1 hour ago, DANGUSDEAN said:

Oh yeah... did someone forget about mxm, and all the lethal police gear in black water. Oh yeah, they also already have a sting (Hint: it a cop weapon)

Sting was a vigilante weapon before it was a cop weapon ;), deputies had PO7s.

The BW cop weapons are lethal.

[ferg 279]

@Merpfer is probably having wet dreams

[-dante- 5156]

1 hour ago, lil boat said:

You provide good points and arguments..... but fuck vigis aye lmao

 

 

 

Boat has hands down the best argument on this thread 

 

But, seriously. 

I actually like some of your ideas for the tier 2 license. The common issue is rule breaking. Too many kids that don't even have mics run around and gun every bounty with their stings. Using an MX would increase the aids. Basically a bunch of bad seeds ruining it for the genuine kids who want to play the right way.

Also, I'd say 5.56, not 6.5. It just doesn't make a lot of sense to give a vigi actual APD equivalent equipment. We have 5.56 in Apd as well but it is very uncommonly used compared to the 6.5. 

Im more against it thanks to the bad apples, but I think your set up brings up a good argument but I'm ultimately against it. But, you bring up good points and aren't just screaming out blasphemy on why Vigis should get more. Keep fighting for it, maybe it happens. 

[Barrack Obama 48]

Just now, DanteFleury said:

Boat has hands down the best argument on this thread 

 

But, seriously. 

I actually like some of your ideas for the tier 2 license. The common issue is rule breaking. Too many kids that don't even have mics run around and gun every bounty with their stings. Using an MX would increase the aids. Basically a bunch of bad seeds ruining it for the genuine kids who want to play the right way.

Also, I'd say 5.56, not 6.5. It just doesn't make a lot of sense to give a vigi actual APD equivalent equipment. We have 5.56 in Apd as well but it is very uncommonly used compared to the 6.5. 

Im more against it thanks to the bad apples, but I think your set up brings up a good argument but I'm ultimately against it. But, you bring up good points and aren't just screaming out blasphemy on why Vigis should get more. Keep fighting for it, maybe it happens. 

So people use rooks to rdm from the gun store should we remove the gun store? People vdm so should we remove the vehicles? People dupe money so should we remove money? 

[-dante- 5156]

Just now, Barrack Obama said:

So people use rooks to rdm from the gun store should we remove the gun store? People vdm so should we remove the vehicles? People dupe money so should we remove money? 

This is an example of taking what I said, and making it something more. The Percentage of people in the server that buy guns and know they need to engage first is higher than the percentage of Vigis that know how to actually be a vigi. 

Talking about removing cars and money for duping and VDM is not worth responding too. That's an ignorant comparison. I'm saying I don't back the idea but I gave everyone here encouragement to keep pushing for it and maybe it happens. 

When debating vigilante, we should probably stay on topic. 

[Bow 787]

I think in the case of this thread, you should definitely let your memes be dreams and nothing more.

[Grandma Gary 10474]

1 hour ago, Merpfer said:

Not all rebels at all. And only high ranking officers have Ghost hawks. Rebels cannot get those things unless they do a blackwater. Which has only been done like 10 times maybe?

10 times in the first day.  History has taught us that the APD sucks at attacking defensible positions. ^_^

 

As for Vigilantes getting bigger guns I wouldn't be totally against.

Kavala scatters are obviously the ones most against it.... Bow, which is a =1 in my book.

Big gangs spend most of their time at cartels and wouldn't encounter vigilantes, so even if Vigis get bigger guns and dare to step foot outside Kavala and encounter a  heavily armed phat bounty chances are the bounty isn't alone and is also gonna shoot their face off.

APD.  One of the big arguments originally implementing Vigilantes was "OMG IS GONA KILL CUP NOBODY PLEH CUP" which didn't happen, at all.  Vigilantes follow the server rules same as the APD, APD on the other hand have those rules plus an entire handbook as well to follow.  Vigilantes pretty much have one extra rule: Don't abuse.  If a cop fucks up their case is tossed to Senior APD and potentially they face demotion unless it is pretty severe in which case staff take care of it, if a vigilante fucks up there are no Senior Vigilantes and the staff take care of it right off the bat and they face a ban. The APD isn't everyone's cup of tea, learning the handbook, going through an interview then the stress of being a useless Deputy when the likes of a Fed or jail start are pretty offputting for a lot of people.  The alternative for those folks is Vigilante.

[Bow 787]

4 minutes ago, Grandma Gary said:

10 times in the first day.  History has taught us that the APD sucks at attacking defensible positions. ^_^

 

As for Vigilantes getting bigger guns I wouldn't be totally against.

Kavala scatters are obviously the ones most against it.... Bow, which is a =1 in my book.

Big gangs spend most of their time at cartels and wouldn't encounter vigilantes, so even if Vigis get bigger guns and dare to step foot outside Kavala and encounter a  heavily armed phat bounty chances are the bounty isn't alone and is also gonna shoot their face off.

APD.  One of the big arguments originally implementing Vigilantes was "OMG IS GONA KILL CUP NOBODY PLEH CUP" which didn't happen, at all.  Vigilantes follow the server rules same as the APD, APD on the other hand have those rules plus an entire handbook as well to follow.  Vigilantes pretty much have one extra rule: Don't abuse.  If a cop fucks up their case is tossed to Senior APD and potentially they face demotion unless it is pretty severe in which case staff take care of it, if a vigilante fucks up there are no Senior Vigilantes and the staff take care of it right off the bat and they face a ban. The APD isn't everyone's cup of tea, learning the handbook, going through an interview then the stress of being a useless Deputy when the likes of a Fed or jail start are pretty offputting for a lot of people.  The alternative for those folks is Vigilante.

I am the scattiest scatter to ever reside in Kavala