The State of Federal Events, As Seen From a Jr. APD Member

[SheriffJohnBeard 309]

Allow POs to use Quillins for Federal Events Only

[dj smokey 16]

8 hours ago, Orbit said:

The less gear you use, the less explosives used, and the less cancer strats abused, all relate to the force responded with

I have an Mk18 kit with level 2 armor and I get sprayed at by 2 ghosthawks at the same time :(( 

[MaybeChoppa 2]

12 hours ago, SPBojo said:

We can (and should) change that  

and give us another weapon

[The Antichrist 237]

9 hours ago, nicole said:

soon

This doesn't work unless there's no nlr at gang bases now.  Was never like that before.  Could just make it take it over for apd until server restart unless someone goes there and recaptures it.   There would be no point at all to slowing down their respawn timer if they're on 15 min NLR already.

4 hours ago, SheriffJohnBeard said:

Allow POs to use Quillins

Fixed it.  There's lite qillins now.  No reason to avoid giving po's a vehicle that will let them die to bullets instead of rocks and bushes.  Tbh. 

It might break some immersion, but all you have to do to escape a PO is go offroad and that's kinda weak. 

[Kaka 16]

.

[batGooseCan 616]

18 hours ago, thomp62 said:

Hello, My name is Thompp. I am a Jr. APD Patrol Officer. I am currently writing this in school, in the middle of my classes. You may have already heard of me from the APD forums because of me complaining about the state of Federal Events and how it’s unfair towards the APD. However, after input from so many sides, including Sr. APD, other Jr. APD, and CIVs participating in the federal events, I decided to take a fresh look at the state of federal events, and that started with data collection. I took a month to pile up every federal event that I personally have participated in, and after looking at it all, as well as playing the federal events myself, I have come up with several conclusions and suggestions.

Before I begin, here are some disclaimers that I want everyone to know:
1. This is not meant to be a forum post about blaming people or factions. This is only a review of the state of Federal Events as seen by a Jr. APD member, and my input about what we can do to make it better for everybody.
2. Being as it is a somewhat biased collection of data (with only my participation being the reason for the data being in the spreadsheet), this is obviously not what it might look like to other people.
3. After arguing in the APD forums, I realize that we have many different opinions about federal events, as well as different experiences. So this is not meant to put down other people’s opinions, but rather give my own opinion and insight.
4. I have reflected and see that federal events are not only unfair for Jr. APD, but also for CIVs going against Sr. APD.
5. Special thanks to @ xsmitherz for his help in formatting the spreadsheet, and @ SPBojo for his insight into what the Civilian side looks like when fighting federal events, as well as many others for their strongly-written opinions.
6. Remember that we are all humans behind the screen. I genuinely want to see federal events changed to be more fair for both the APD and the CIVs participating in it. I want us to all have fun with federal events. It shouldn’t be a punishment to fight these federal events, but rather something we want to look forward to.
7. This might look like I'm yapping to most of you guys, but this is truly what I feel and what most Jr. APD feels about federal events.
8. In the end, this is all a game. If the game is frustrating, it’s completely okay to take a step back and relax.
9. Here's the spreadsheet for everyone to view https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1b4mRgCor2VFw1QxEcVcvOyCe1W3PhPabq6VmRTlnt6w/edit?resourcekey#gid=1645404173

—---------------------------------------------------—---------------------------------------------------—--------------------------------------------------------------—---------------------------------------------------—----------------
 

When I was a deputy about 5 months ago, I had my first federal event and genuinely enjoyed it. Not only was it fair on both sides with nearly equal numbers of people, but also it wasn’t too cancerous for either side fighting and it wasn’t some deadbrain wave and die, wave and die type event. Recently however, I’ve noticed that this attitude towards federal events had changed. Not only for me, but for many other Jr. APD and Civs. Now, it wasn’t fun, but rather egregious and annoying to play. When Jr. APD watched as the popup for federal events showed, instead of being ecstatic, they would rather log off or groan. It was like watching a bunch of children after telling them “It’s bedtime”. For Civilians, I am sure this is the same feeling when Sr. APD begins mass-armor waves. 

Curiously, I wondered why such a change had occurred. Why were Jr. APD being punished for just playing the game? We don’t log in just to be tortured. We want to have fun. That is why I began talking to different sides and also collecting data, and looking at the APD handbook and server rules. I came to the conclusion that it was due to both sides overreacting, and seeking “revenge” upon each other, and Jr. APD being caught in the crossfire. Sr. APD began mass-pulling armor waves, Civs started running in large groups, which in turn made even more armor waves, which in turn forced Civs to use RPGs and Zafirs and other weaponry. Now, Civs are at the limit of how much they can keep pulling, whilst Sr. APD can still continue to use more weaponry. (As seen in recent blackwater events, where APD has started winning more than before). This ramp up in the level of weapons used has caused a disruption in the balance of power, and Jr. APD was forced to just sit there and endure the everlasting torture. 

So what exactly can we do, both as APD and as Civs, to ensure that the federal events we fight are fair, fun, and doesn’t leave anyone wanting to die in the end? As it stands, the only group that is unable to scale up to these increased levels of cancer are Jr. APD. This leaves many Jr. APD wondering what they are useful for in federal events, besides running in to die, baiting for Sr. APD, and trying to defuse the bomb. Of course, there are moments where Jr. APD shines, however these moments are few to none. I propose we add some rank in between Patrol Officer and Corporal, where they are able to use lethals in federal events, and ONLY federal events, and of course with very strict requirements. The only people who could obtain this rank are those with 100+ hours in APD, 20+ days Time in Grade, and are trusted within the APD community. 

For Sr. APD, I propose we add some rule changes that restricts how much armor is allowed per wave, depending on the amount of civs participating in these events. For example, 2 armored vehicles per every 4 civs. (ex. 8 armored vehicles when fighting 16 civs). Not only will this limit how much money Sr. APD will be forced to lose (as I know that Sr. APD doesn’t like pulling armor for this reason), but also it will decrease the amount of weapons used by Civs and reduce the amount of cancer occurring in the federal events at this moment, which in turn will reduce the cross-fire that Jr. APD has to deal with. I also propose we add rules regulating waves, and only having certain things after a certain amount of waves. (Ex. After the 3rd wave, armor can be pulled. After the 5th, lethals can be loaded for Jr APD.)

For proportionality, I propose we add new rules that regulate how many Civs / APD can participate in the federal events, depending on Civs / APD size. For example, we could have 1.5 APD per every 1 Civ. This could lead to the problem of Sr. APD forcing Jr. APD to leave so that they can replace them, but this could be fixed by enforcing a minimum amount of Jr. APD that must be in the federal event.

All in all, I believe that federal events should be fun to fight. It shouldn’t be some torture-fest or some punishment for Jr. APD. I genuinely enjoy playing APD and I want that feeling to be the same for everyone else, especially after federal events. There’s no point in playing a game that will just make you frustrated, after all. With Rexo in charge of the APD now, I believe that we can work together to make changes that benefit us all, and allow federal events to enter a new stage of strategy and excitement. 

TLDR: Federal events are cancerous for everyone, please come together to fix it.
 

federal reserve win strat rn is pull so much armor and smoke so much that the server lags. Cops then jump over a wall and kill civs that cannot see them! Very fun

[jig 2115]

not taking a side here but why the fuck is it literally only  @ billdroid  and @ Orbit  defending the APD. SR APD these days are so useless its crazy. Brandyn only one contributing 

[Orbit 295]

6 hours ago, batGooseCan said:

federal reserve win strat rn is pull so much armor and smoke so much that the server lags. Cops then jump over a wall and kill civs that cannot see them! Very fun

This is not at all the strat batcan. Smoke is used to block angles and the armor is used to make it to the wall lol. Aegis was raised inside a canister of smoke nothing new for them.

[Grizzly 383]

44 minutes ago, jig said:

not taking a side here but why the fuck is it literally only  @ billdroid  and @ Orbit  defending the APD. SR APD these days are so useless its crazy. Brandyn only one contributing 

@ Rexo  @ nicole  @ Caden  @ Xlax  @ Hazardous  @ YakGod  @ GST  @ Clashingtin  @ xsmitherz  @ Dr.Dream  @ CaloomClark

[nicole 808]

On 4/10/2024 at 12:00 PM, thomp62 said:

Federal events are cancerous for everyone, please come together to fix it.

Federal events have and always will be cancerous and no one will come together because they all hate each other and want to cancer each other. Just how it goes, the APD abuses the civilians, and the civilians abuse the APD and any other gang that attempts to do federal events, and by civilians, I mean Aegis. But what I find to be the most disturbing is the fact that you can get mod, then be promoted to admin and automatically be allowed to put $200 million in your deposit box, and no one bats an eye. Why do I have to do 10 tedious development cards to get 80 mil? (not that i want infinate money i am just saying) Admins look at a few tickets, barley meet their minimums, and they get to do that shit. Infinite money is stupid and even more stupid when one of the easiest and least work intensive roles on the server get it. (admins)

Mod 1 (No infinite money) - 2 weeks of commenting on tickets whether or not you'd take action (no work needed)

Mod 2 (No infinite money) - month or so of handling tickets (inacurately or sometimes accurately)

Admin (infinite money) - respond to the easiest tickets, sit afk, spawn money, and don't get removed after never meeting ticket minimums

they had to make up "Any" bans because the ban appeals wouldn't be responded to before the ban expired 

[Clashingtin 1098]

1 hour ago, Grizzly said:

@ Rexo  @ nicole  @ Caden  @ Xlax  @ Hazardous  @ YakGod  @ GST  @ Clashingtin  @ xsmitherz  @ Dr.Dream  @ CaloomClark

I don’t feel like getting into all of this tbh I just play the game and fight the feds balanced or not 

[Lea 1402]

I have a solution. Give the POs tanks.

   I don't understand why you wouldn't want the hardest fights possible, considering it is a massive group of the best players. Make it harder, buff the APD. 

[Elijah1 46]

7 minutes ago, Lea said:

I have a solution. Give the POs tanks.

   I don't understand why you wouldn't want the hardest fights possible, considering it is a massive group of the best players. Make it harder, buff the APD. 

If we give you a pass to buy free cupcakes you would let us have tanks

[Lea 1402]

11 minutes ago, Elijah1 said:

If we give you a pass to buy free cupcakes you would let us have tanks

I'm saying give you the tanks now regardless of free cupcakes. 

[Hazardous 532]

Everyone became so soft overtime and just needs to be spoon fed. Everyone plays the game as if they need to win 24/7 and cannot accept a loss. There will always be someone better than you. Prime days where when you had no restrictions on your proportionality at a federal event. The event that has highest reward should have highest risk and you should be able to go in and accept it. Not when you when in and did a federal event with 3-5 people and sent a message hoping you'd get a range of ~5 cops to respond to your fed proportionally. If you did a federal event back then you actually needed to coordinate one and come prepared. Then this comes into the question of why we have so many players/gangs that hold $1bill+ in such a short time frame from when our only player that had $1bill+ for the longest time was CatsMeow; the kingpin of Tree that did runs 24/7 and owned the bottom right of the map, including Moonshine. Then things like gambling had to be made to help with the influx of money going around to help destroy/limit/maintain the economy.

 

Nothing against Aegis whatsoever or any members of it. I understand they are the most active gang and are never sleeping... but open Top 50 and tell me if you see any indicators of something concerning. Compare the playtime, the members and the differences in bank. Open Top 5 and see how many in the Top 5 that have over a billion dollars are Aegis. The answer is 3/5 with Sevro(Timmy) being #1 at "$2,047,271,552" on an ALT. Mcpooperson at $1,205,813,504 & Kyle being 1,112,320,128. Open gang bank and look at the differences between the gang money and the players within each bank. Compare the hours. 

#1	timmy	$2,047,271,552
#2	Blevins	$1,223,902,464
#3	SWAT 123n	$1,205,813,504
#4	cuckledoo	$1,118,386,688
#5	scarr	$1,112,320,128

This isn't to bash Aegis or to say they "Run" the server. But things like this are what gives a large impression on the statistics of things we battle against in roundtables. When is the last time you've seen a regular gang or a newer gang attempt to do a federal event? When is the last time they have won on their own? You have Aegis/Tp/GLM making majority of the federal event statistics where they come in planning to dominate the APD and win or they come in with regular kits and a small group to just balance out the stats to decrease win rate %. There are loopholes to these statistics as now groups have been implemented in which also another question comes into play.. Since the faction restriction for APD is 20.. what is the group restriction on civs? I know I have fought against a Fed with over 20 civs in the SAME group when we're limited to only 20 regardless if they are running around with a Sting or not.

 

That's just the way I see it. Everyone has became so soft and no longer knows how to play a game as a game. They live off it & strive to be #1 whether if it takes away others enjoyment. 

[JoeL 1296]

17 minutes ago, Hazardous said:

group restriction on civs

Petition for a group cap +1

[Zeuse 1240]

1 hour ago, nicole said:

Just how it goes, the APD abuses the civilians, and the civilians abuse the APD and any other gang that attempts to do federal events, and by civilians, I mean Aegis.

17 minutes ago, Hazardous said:

When is the last time you've seen a regular gang or a newer gang attempt to do a federal event? When is the last time they have won on their own?

Funny that you mention that, actually, since a 5 man fed was just taken over by Aegis whilst the APD were discussing telling officers not to respond as we had too many. 

[Bubbaloo - Reusable P Cup 3037]

What I would like is just require a minimum APD members to respond to a fed and then whoever else ones to join is optional. I can’t be bothered to fight feds anymore. I know sAPD can tell others not to join but rarely ever do so I just go there and want to kill myself with a fucking spoon smacking against my head every time I get one tapped from an MK1 that recoils like crazy from 1000 meters out. 
 

 

[silton 4174]

30 minutes ago, Bubbaloo - Reusable P Cup said:

What I would like is just require a minimum APD members to respond to a fed and then whoever else ones to join is optional. I can’t be bothered to fight feds anymore. I know sAPD can tell others not to join but rarely ever do so I just go there and want to kill myself with a fucking spoon smacking against my head every time I get one tapped from an MK1 that recoils like crazy from 1000 meters out. 
 

 

I can understand where you're coming from but you're really doing the rest of the APD dirty by sitting out. Feds are just part of the game for the APD just like sitting in jail for 30mins picking rubbish is part of the game for civs.

[Bubbaloo - Reusable P Cup 3037]

8 minutes ago, silton said:

I can understand where you're coming from but you're really doing the rest of the APD dirty by sitting out. Feds are just part of the game for the APD just like sitting in jail for 30mins picking rubbish is part of the game for civs.

I get that too. I begrudgingly still participate. 

[The Antichrist 237]

Feds and blackwaters are economy busters.  APD should limit themselves at banks, vehicle yards, pharmas and drug patrols, but unless theyre stacked 15+ deep, should go full force at feds and bw's regardless.  Those aren't starter events.  They're end game, and should be treated as such.

[CaloomClark 1321]

IMO this is all just blown out of proportion.

I think @ Zeuse  and I showed this perfectly today.
7v7 blackwater with a medic vs 2 deps, 2 PO’s a sgt and an Lt.

We pulled 0 armour and no lethals were auth’d. You guys (aegis) were not being aids with the loadouts or numbers and all in all a good fight was had, with the APD defusing at, I believe 7 minutes.

Unfortunately, when civs pull crazy gear there just isn’t anything the APD have to counter it. We have tried armour vs no armour, when civs have crazy gear it’s just pointless, either get ripped in a shitty hunter by any gun or RPG’d, on the other hand you can try slamming in hatchbacks and will get ripped 99% of the time. - even if you manage a lethal it doesn’t matter in the slightest due to most having medic’s. BW’s back in the day never had people using this sort of gear consistently and it forces us to go to our “last resort” (lethals + hunters) instantly AND STILL MAKING LITTLE PROGRESS. 
 

I have played on both sides, as SAPD and Aegis. I would much rather do a federal event with a normal loadout with a senior not being aids (as they should) vs a zafir rpg t5 event brainlessly ripping hunters and dealing with the aids. I would like to see both sides just take a step back, and fight these events in good spirits without having each group just completely cancer the other to the point that neither has a good time.

 

[Tman15tmb 1827]

It would be nice if there was a rule against medics being taken into a fed event. Nothing more exhilarating than being locked in a dome doing nothing for 30 minutes. It's a clear advantage that makes feds more cancerous than they need to be. Will this change? Probably not, but I can dream.

[SPBojo 6863]

4 minutes ago, Tman15tmb said:

It would be nice if there was a rule against medics being taken into a fed event. Nothing more exhilarating than being locked in a dome doing nothing for 30 minutes. It's a clear advantage that makes feds more cancerous than they need to be. Will this change? Probably not, but I can dream.

With the ability for APD to authorize lethals this will never happen.

[The Antichrist 237]

Could just rebalance it by banning everyone who keeps kit copies in a telos house and breaks nlr to come back.