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Civilian Representative

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Roundtable Summary 2022-06-25




  • Rework SWAT. @ doctor doom
    • Remove APD Requirement.
    • Rework Senior SWAT.
      • Senior SWAT are not enforcing rules.
      • Sergeant Rank should be restructured to a merit based promotion for players who have experience & lead (like Corporal on S1) 
      • Allow LT+ to accept applications.
        • The current system only allows @ Caden to accept SWAT applications.
        • The current system is gatekeeping a dying faction. 
        • Should allow a lower standard of acceptance in order to increase SWAT roster/ skill.
        • Willing to establish a new alternative metric for application evaluation.
        • Factors:
          • Ban History within previous month of application.
          • Conquest Time/ Experience.
          • Community Standing: (Whitelists including APD, Support, CC, etc.).

Results: [1] The official requirement for deputy will be dropped, however, it will still be up to Sr SWAT's discretion to determine who can be accepted into SWAT (including, but not limited to the factors listed below). Ie, players with excessive conquest experience and clean ban history should be accepted, but @ Caden will still retain the ability to deny applications for players that appear unfit for the role. There may be additional discussion on this point with Head CC & Caden to further settle on something agreeable. Changes to application metrics have already been established internally. 


  • Drug Cartel Perk/ Value Changes @ WALT
    • Owning the Drug Cartel automatically speeds up processing to 50% processing bonus for Meth & Moonshine.
    • Owning the Drug Cartel automatically processes Weed, Cocaine, Heroin, & Mushroom to double processed, instead of the current two cycle process for drugs.
      • Incentives Fights & Incentivizes Illegal Runs
  • Change the current drug cartel tax system @ WALT
    • Instead of taxing sales, tax processing instead.
    • Value is determined based on individual drugs at a max flat rate.

Reason for Denial: [1] There is already a speed buff when owning the cartel, along with many other benefits (eg tax on sales, passive income, etc). [2] Seeing lots of opposition to this; if you want to buff cartels, I don't think this is the way to go about it. Especially considering that someone doing runs isn't going to be able to consistently pivot to cartel fighting. Overall, this probably wouldn't have a huge impact on cartels but could significantly harm runs. 


  • Suicide Vest Rule Change. @ Pol
    • Suicide vests can now be used to kill restrained players. If the APD or the Hostage takers group, spots a tagged gang member from said group with a suicide vest on they can KOS.
      • Players can already crossfire with a Grenade and such + contradicting statements from staff makes it unclear whether you can crossfire with a vest or not, this rule change is healthy as the vest alone is expensive, rarely used, and give much need clarification on grey area.
    • Rule Change - Chapter 15: Explosive Items:
      • Suicide vests may be used at any time following normal roleplay rules. Misuse of suicide vests to kill restrained players or destroy vehicles for no reason may still result in administrative action. Suicide vests may be used to kill restrained gang & group members. APD & players holding said player in restraints may KOS spotted gang member wearing a suicide vest.

Reason for Denial: [1] See @ David Miller's response outlining what you can and cannot do; it's almost already allowed, but with some constraints to force a little bit of roleplay.


  • Move Platinum Processor to a new & location. @ TroyOGG
    • Players who participate in run, want a better & safer spot for processing.
    • Due to long travel distance & low pay from platinum, it seems justified.

Reason for Denial: [1] Already changed recently, also no reason to further buff legal runs at this current time. https://gyazo.com/92351982985ff66371194a34956c2e7e


  • Add RPG-42 to Blackwater Loot Table. @ doctor doom
    • Item is to be set as "Ultra Rare"

Reasoning: [1] Was added as a new dynamic item for the Blackwater loot pool, to give a new rare item to the civilian arsenal.

  • Add Verona to Blackwater Loot Table @ doctor doom
    • Item is to be set as "Ultra Rare"
    • Limit range on Verona to "2 Kilometers" amount.

Reason for Denial: Wire guided ground missiles have no place in a life server.

  • Pharma Changes: @ Big John1
    • Change 85% Drop Off -> 50% Drop Off
    • Create a 200% Pharmaceutical Drop-Off near Pygros.

Reasoning: [1] Changes were established because the 85% Drop Off is highly uncontested for both APD & Civilians, leading to this event to be too easy and a money farm for civilians. Therefore, nerfing 85% and adding a 200% Drop-Off will add to the dynamic of pharma for both Civilians & APD. The 200% location will be located near Pygros, so it won't be an easy "cop out" option.

  • Remove CMR from Patrol Officers. @ Big John1
    • Too overpowered for the ability for all patrol officers to use.

Reason for Denial: [1] Gun is not widely used, and there is no valid reason for weapon to be removed from Patrol Officers.

  • Limit APD to 2 Striders per wave at Federal Events. @ Big John1
    • Only limiting total number of striders pulled for Federal Events, this does not include Hunters.
    • Too much smoke & smoke fighting at Federal Events

Reason for Denial: [1] There are circumstances where this may make sense, but others where it does not. If re-proposed, there should be some included bounds where this is applicable (ie, escalation parameters). Additionally, the current fed stats are learning in the favor of civilians, so it's probably not an optimal time to make this change. 

  • Increase time to search red zones for APD from 15 Minutes -> 20 Minutes. @ virus
    • Rule Change will be in effect from June 26th and rolled back on July 25th. 
    • WPL bonus will be nerfed 5% ( 20% -> 15%)
    • Some illegal processers will receive changes to be more defendable in the August Update. 

Reasoning: [1] Currently APD numbers are at an all time high, while the percentage of illegal runs being completed is decreasing. We need a reason for players to do more illegal runs, which is why a smaller risk for players to complete these runs are the best way to go about the change to cater to current server population. Rule change is being assessed through a trial period, to determine if illegal run productivity is increased, with that being said WPL bonus was determined to be nerfed with change by 5%. With this change it was determined to buff processers locations for illegal runs, to maker runs easier to defend rather than being a sitting duck waiting to be robbed.


  • Rule Restricting amount of medics that can be taken for a Federal Event
    • The number of medics allowed to be taken would go on the number of medics online.
      • 1-3 Medics Online (Hostages Max 1)
      • 4-5 Medics Online (Hostages Max 2)
      • 6+ Medics Online (Hostages Max 3)

Reasoning: [1] This will help maintain the ability for other players to still be revived across the island when there's an active federal event. This should significantly reduce the number of complaints that Senior R&R receive of  “Medic didn’t revive me” // “I bled out, and the medic didn’t even move” //.

  • R&R Enter As Co-pilot
    • Simple QOL change; allows medics to enter as copilot without unlocking their helicopter.


  • Weapon seizure gives 10% of weapon value split between all APD Officers in the area. 
    • Eg. An APD Officer seizing an MK-1 ($125k) would receive a split of $12.5k. 

Reasoning: [1] APD Officers receive money for seizing virtual illegal items and this should be no different for illegal/charge permitting seizure weapons. A 10% value of the weapon is a reasonable amount of money for disposing of an illegal/charge permitting seizure weapon. Rare weapon item seizure prices are to be evaluated further.

  • Flares and Radar notification to Hummingbird. 
    • The Hummingbird is already an exposed vehicle that is not difficult to shoot down. The lack of flares and radar means it has no counter to titans. 

Reason for Denial: [1] It was determined that their is no reason to add flares for the same reason that vanilla Arma does not include flares on Hummingbirds. It is determined if you wish to have flares on Heli, players should just have to pay for an upgrade for a vehicle that has flares, rather than go cheap and risk being titaned. Perks of paying high value for said protection. Also it was seen as an issue for players that bench snipe, it would give them too much of an advantage.

  • Black, Dazzle and Olive Hummingbird variants for SGT+ for patrol.
    • The Hummingbird is already an exposed vehicle that is not difficult to shoot down. This adds additional varients for SGT+ to utilize for patrol.

Reason for Denial: [1] APD Vehicles shall have APD textures; if you don't like your current texture; please work with texture design to get a new one.

  • Ifrit to Active Captain+
    • Limited to utilizing one Ifrit on the server at a time. 
    • Adds an additional armoured vehicle to the APD arsenal. This is balanced due to it only being accessible by Active Captain+ and limited to only being able to utilize one Ifrit on the server at a time. 

Reason for Denial: [1] Ifrits will not be added to the APD outside of SWAT; additionally, captain was justified as a whitelist with perks no different than LT as a bridge between LT and deputy chief, we intend to uphold this decision. 

  • Mushroom converted to illegal item. 
    • Cow Manure Field changes to a redzone.
    • Mushroom is a low risk run that is the only single field illegal run that the field is not illegal. Mushroom contributes a significant amount of money to the economy and needs to have additional risk. 

Reason for Denial: [1] Diversity in runs is good; if you think mushrooms are too strong given their situation, a price of distance change would be more appropriate. 

  • Increase Ghillie Suit price. 
    • Marksmen $10k -> $25k
    • Rat Ghillie (non-marksman DLC) $10k -> $15k

Reasoning: [1] Obscures player's names at close distances providing a considerable advantage for a currently negligible price. 

  • Increase bullet damage to tires by 30%. 
    • Tires currently take a more than reasonable amount of bullets to shoot out tires on vehicles. Increasing damage to tires makes it easier for everyone to disable vehicles rather than being forced to attempt to pit. 

Reason for Denial: [1] Many tires are already very easy to destroy, especially with the resources already at the APD's disposal.

  • Remove armour stacking on server 1, convert to Conquest System. 
    • CSAT/Granit would only be able to be worn with a tier 2 vest. 
    • Pilot Coveralls (only obtainable from Federal Events/Airdrop) would still be able to be worn with any tier vest.
  • Solution:
    • Granit's in-shop are not stackable with t3+
    • Remove one variant of granits from warpoint shop and make item event exclusive like pcovs.

Reasoning: [1] Players are able to wear granits which are reasonably low priced for the considerable amount of protection they provide, paired with a tier 3 or higher vest which in the case of the tier 3 is purchasable for a low price. This turns players into bullet sponges and causes a significant disparity compared to a majority of the APDs armour and the armour of newer or less war orientated players. Solution was created to make granits less accessible and more expensive. 

  • APD Escort Vehicle spawns tier 4. 

Reasoning: [1] The APD escort vehicle spawning tier 0 means it is sluggish to drive. Changing the vehicle spawn to tier 4 mirrors how the Blackwater vehicles spawn. 

  • There will be a maximum number of 2/3/4 Qilin/Prowlers per small/ medium/ large APD escort. 

Reasoning: [1] This was originally added to the APD Handbook when the APD Escort Event was first added to limit the number Qilins/Prowlers that the APD utilizes during the event. Since the event has been added and APD Officers have conducted the event a considerable number of civilians usually attempt to stop the event to get the high value loot from the vehicle. Due to the number of civilians and the gear that they use attempting to counter the event it is no longer felt limiting Qilins/Prowlers vehicles is necessary. 


You can find the roster for the @Head Civilian Council here. As always you can find details on how to apply here:



Recommended Comments

Only a 5 war point increase for granits? With how easy it is to buy war points, I doubt that'll have much of an effect, would've preferred the conquest system, armour stacking makes fighting cops at range trivial.


Was also hoping for the mushroom change, a good 75% of the time when we check mushroom proc there's people there, and it's weird to just show up and then not be able to do anything but "please leave the area sir".


Rest of the changes are pretty great. Lol @ trying to remove CMR too, hardly anyone uses it.

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21 minutes ago, jasper_ said:

Was also hoping for the mushroom change, a good 75% of the time when we check mushroom proc there's people there, and it's weird to just show up and then not be able to do anything but "please leave the area sir".


Hey man. I mentioned two other alternatives they could have decided to try and push on the roundtable, but they insisted on this one.

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I read pretty much all of the discussions for the roundtables before they went to the actual meeting, and I think theres a pretty good balance of accepted and denied proposals from all sides. Good that there were tweaks to some things instead of flat out accepting/denying the idea. 

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While I'm normally civilian biased even though I mostly play cop, leaving cmrs to PO+ was a good choice considering that taking it would be a significant run buff considering the difficulty in taking out vehicles such as the tempest. Good changes overall, I hope to see more people doing illegal activities with these changes. 

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3 minutes ago, Big John1 said:

No , When I pitched the idea it was only to nerf armor stacking with the granites that are purchasable in warpoint shop.  Allowing the gear gained from airdrops/blackwater/evidence locker to retain their value. 

Except this is the staff roundtable that I’m talking about. I remember pcovs being limited to t3 and below vaguely but I could’ve also swore there was an agreement to increase their cost from 5->7 wp 

am I tripping? I remember because@ Mako  thought that the change wouldn’t help with armor stacking. 

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2 minutes ago, Big John1 said:

you are talking about regular csats not pcovs. pcovs cannot be purchased for warpoints

we discussed briefly increasing regular csat price from 5-7 wps

however armor stacking with them would remain the same 

Ah yes, thanks for the reminder. 

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